ARLA/CLUSTER: Passagem atribulada paraaTVDigitalTerrestrenosE.U.A.
Paulo Calvo
paulo.calvo brilhomania.pt
Sexta-Feira, 8 de Maio de 2009 - 17:47:32 WEST
O colega deve perceber imenso do assunto mas explique lá como é que você
mete bits no layer 1.
O layer 1 é fisico, ali não há bits...
O layer 2 difere do layer 3 no facto de o endereçamento ser local enquanto
no layer 3 é global.
O TCP é layer 4, o IP é layer 3. Claro que o IP é anterior ao modelo OSI e
por isso não há correspodência directa entre os dois.
Alhos e bugalhos, talvez...
Paulo Calvo
CT1IDW
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jose Miguel Fonte" <etjfonte ua.pt>
To: "Resumo Noticioso Electrónico ARLA" <cluster radio-amador.net>
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 4:54 PM
Subject: Re: ARLA/CLUSTER: Passagem atribulada
paraaTVDigitalTerrestrenosE.U.A.
>O Colega está a misturar alhos com bugalhos.
>
> Em telecomunicações, no modelo OSI, nas camadas baixas (1 e 2) fala-se
> em bits da 3 para cima fala-se em bytes. O TCP/IP já é da camada 3, logo
> falamos em bytes ou octetos. E se no Wikipidea diz que não é um
> standard, pois enfim...
>
> Veja:
> http://catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/B/byte.html
>
> "A unit of memory or data equal to the amount used to represent one
> character; on modern architectures this is *invariably 8 bits*. Some
> older architectures used byte for quantities of 6, 7, or (especially) 9
> bits, and the PDP-10 supported bytes that were actually bitfields of 1
> to 36 bits! These usages are now obsolete, killed off by universal
> adoption of power-of-2 word sizes"
> .
>
> Tanto o IEC e o JEDEC adoptaram isto como standard.
>
> IEC: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_60027
> JEDEC: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JEDEC_memory_standards
>
> Voltando à questão, 1 byte são 8 bits? É disso que estamos a falar,
> continuo a afirmar que 1 byte são 8 bits.
>
> Se um ISP fornece 18Mb/s e se a informação que lá passa, no nosso caso,
> é informação de PC's, o transporte são bits (bytes por consequência) de
> informação, podemos aproximar um valor real de transferência em bytes.
> Aproximar, porque como referi, em telecomunicações existem sempre
> "overhead" introduzido pelas camadas mais baixas no modelo OSI (ISO),
> eg. informação de protocolo e roteamento. Logo a velocidade será
> aproximada e não o resultado de um eventual cálculo directo. Como as
> próprias tramas dependem das aplicações/serviços, este próprio valor
> difere, existem também muitos pacotes sem informação relevante, seja
> sincronismo, roteamento, etc.
>
> Logo, em teoria, os tais 18Mb/s dariam uma taxa equivalente de 2.1458
> MB/s. Este valor nunca consegue ser atingido como referi, devido ao
> overhead, mas dá para ter uma ideia, cerca de 2MB/s. Ou seja, um
> ficheiro de 6 mega deveria ser transferido em aprox. 3 segundos.
>
> (b = bit & B = Byte).
>
> Reitero o que disse, 1 byte são 8 bits.
> No dia em que um "char" não for 8 bits, ai ai...
>
> 73 de ct1enq.
>
>
> On Fri, 2009-05-08 at 16:12 +0100, Paulo Calvo wrote:
>> Boas
>>
>> Para quem está limitado aos PCs isso pode fazer algum sentido.
>> Para quem trabalha com outros equipamentos isso é asneira.
>> Num router com interfaces STM16 ninguém pensa em trabalhar com larguras
>> de
>> bus de oito bits ou programar pensando em bytes...
>> Aliás nem os PC's usam bus de 8 bits.
>>
>> Claro que esta discussão não leva a nenhum lado.
>> Mas leia:
>> A byte (pronounced /ˈbaɪt/) is a basic unit of measurement of information
>> storage in computer science. In many computer architectures it is a unit
>> of
>> memory addressing. There is no standard but a byte most often consists of
>> eight bits.
>>
>> Quando o tipo da Cisco levantou a questão do byte ser um valor variável
>> foi
>> quando falou em bit slicing.
>> Neste caso não faz sentido falar em bytes.
>> Byte quer dizer dentada e no caso do processamento de dados refere-se à
>> quantidade de dados binários (bits, pedaços) que o processador morde de
>> cada
>> vez.
>>
>> Acerca do sampling rate e do tio Nyquist. Os débitos binários existentes
>> nas
>> telecomunicações sincronas (aliás pleosincronas) têm tudo a ver com o
>> espectro da voz humana.
>>
>> Mas fique na sua.
>>
>> Paulo Calvo
>>
>> CT1IDW
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Jose Miguel Fonte" <etjfonte ua.pt>
>> To: "Resumo Noticioso Electrónico ARLA" <cluster radio-amador.net>
>> Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 3:30 PM
>> Subject: Re: ARLA/CLUSTER: Passagem atribulada para
>> aTVDigitalTerrestrenosE.U.A.
>>
>>
>> > Se a Cisco faz referência a isso, deve ser nas notas introdutórias,
>> > d'outra forma, façam outros manuais.
>> >
>> > Repare que eu disse, SÃO SEMPRE e não FORAM SEMPRE. De facto, 1 byte é
>> > uma convenção que nos anos 60/70 oscilava muito em função da empresa,
>> > pois todo o desenvolvimento (e a mentalidade) ocorria de outra maneira.
>> >
>> > Os sistemas eram propriétarios, assim como os periféricos.
>> > Se eu fizer um processador de 10 bits e disser a mim mesmo que 1 Byte
>> > são 10 bits, seja. Depois tenho de fazer um compilador para o meu
>> > sistema, as minhas aplicações só executam nesse mesmo sistema, etc.
>> >
>> > Com a proliferação de sistemas baseados na arquitectura x86 (8-bit) a
>> > tendência uniformizou-se e hoje em dia, não faz qualquer sentido dizer
>> > que 1 byte não são 8 bits. Se assim fosse, quando comprasse uma memória
>> > de 1GB teria de especificar que essa seria para um computador de x
>> > bits,
>> > ou que o tamanho de um disco variava com a arquitectura do computador a
>> > utilizar. Isso não acontece, e se ler no Wikipidea, logo abaixo do que
>> > transcreveu, em "Usage":
>> >
>> > "A byte often designates a contiguous sequence of a fixed number of
>> > bits
>> > (binary digits). The use of a byte to mean 8 bits has become nearly
>> > ubiquitous."
>> >
>> > O melhor será ler na versão portuguesa:
>> >
>> > "A codificação padronizada de byte foi definida como sendo de 8 bits. O
>> > byte de 8 bits é, por vezes, também chamado de octeto, nomeadamente no
>> > contexto de redes de computadores e telecomunicações."
>> >
>> > Logo percebe o conceito de octeto, que vem de oito. Se fossem 16 seria
>> > hexteto.
>> >
>> > Logo o que disse está errado, num computador de 8, 16, 32 ou 64 bits, 1
>> > Byte é sempre 8 bits, como referi. Alias, mesmo em outros adoptou-se
>> > este padrão.
>> >
>> > Em redes, utiliza-se muito a noção de octecto, os próprios endereços IP
>> > são compostos por 4 octetos (4 bytes):
>> >
>> > 1 byte = 8 bits -> 2^8 = 256 -> [0 ... 255]
>> >
>> > 255.255.255.255 que em representação hexadecimal será FF:FF:FF:FF
>> >
>> > Quanto a frequências de amostragem, e resolução de ADCs, isso é outra
>> > coisa. Quantos mais bits na amostragem, mais resolução, existem,
>> > sistemas áudio com 8, 16, 24 bits no entanto não se aplicam noções de
>> > byte. A amostragem tem a ver com o Nyquist que fica para outro dia.
>> >
>> > 73 de ct1enq
>> >
>> >
>> > On Fri, 2009-05-08 at 12:11 +0100, Paulo Calvo wrote:
>> >> Boas,
>> >>
>> >> Se voltar a encontrar o tipo da Cisco que me ensinou esta coisa eu
>> >> informo-o
>> >> disso.
>> >> Talvez a Cisco resolva resolva reescrever os manuais internos ;-)
>> >>
>> >> Já agora e para quem sabe inglês:
>> >>
>> >> A byte (pronounced /ˈbaɪt/) is a basic unit of measurement of
>> >> information
>> >> storage in computer science. In many computer architectures it is a
>> >> unit
>> >> of
>> >> memory addressing. There is no standard but a byte most often consists
>> >> of
>> >> eight bits.
>> >>
>> >> A byte is an ordered collection of bits, with each bit denoting a
>> >> single
>> >> binary value of 1 or 0. The byte most often consists of 8 bits in
>> >> modern
>> >> systems; however, the size of a byte can vary and is generally
>> >> determined
>> >> by
>> >> the underlying computer operating system or hardware. Historically,
>> >> byte
>> >> size was determined by the number of bits required to represent a
>> >> single
>> >> character from a Western character set. Its size was generally
>> >> determined
>> >> by
>> >> the number of possible characters in the supported character set and
>> >> was
>> >> chosen to be a divisor of the computer's word size. Historically bytes
>> >> have
>> >> ranged from five to twelve bits.
>> >>
>> >> The popularity of IBM's System/360 architecture starting in the 1960s
>> >> and
>> >> the explosion of microcomputers based on 8-bit microprocessors in the
>> >> 1980s
>> >> has made eight bits by far the most common size for a byte. The term
>> >> octet
>> >> is widely used as a more precise synonym where ambiguity is
>> >> undesirable
>> >> (for
>> >> example, in protocol definitions).
>> >>
>> >> There has been considerable confusion about the meanings of SI (or
>> >> metric)
>> >> prefixes used with the word "byte", especially concerning prefixes
>> >> such
>> >> as
>> >> kilo- (k or K) and mega- (M) as shown in the chart Prefixes for bit
>> >> and
>> >> byte. Since computer memory is designed with dual logic, multiples are
>> >> expressed in power of two, rather than 10, the software and computer
>> >> industries often use binary estimates of the SI-prefixed quantities,
>> >> while
>> >> producers of computer storage devices prefer the SI values. This is
>> >> the
>> >> reason for specifying computer hard drive capacities of, say, "100 GB"
>> >> when
>> >> it contains 93 GiB (or 93 GB in traditional units) of addressable
>> >> storage.
>> >> Because of the confusion, a contract specifying a quantity of bytes
>> >> must
>> >> define what the prefixes mean in terms of the contract (i.e., the
>> >> alternative binary equivalents or the actual decimal values, or a
>> >> binary
>> >> estimate based on the actual values).
>> >>
>> >> Agradeço a correcção, apesar de incorrecta.
>> >>
>> >> Paulo Calvo
>> >>
>> >> CT1DW
>> >> ----- Original Message -----
>> >> From: "Jose Miguel Fonte" <etjfonte ua.pt>
>> >> To: "Resumo Noticioso Electrónico ARLA" <cluster radio-amador.net>
>> >> Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 10:51 AM
>> >> Subject: Re: ARLA/CLUSTER: Passagem atribulada para a
>> >> TVDigitalTerrestrenosE.U.A.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> >1 byte SÃO SEMPRE 8 bits, uma word é que pode diferir de processador
>> >> > para processador.
>> >> >
>> >> > 73 de ct1enq
>> >> >
>> >> > On Fri, 2009-05-08 at 10:39 +0100, Paulo Calvo wrote:
>> >> >> Boas
>> >> >>
>> >> >> As velocidades de transmissão são expressas em bits por segundo,
>> >> >> nunca
>> >> >> em
>> >> >> bytes por segundo.
>> >> >> Há muitos anos atrás um dos meus mestres ensinou-me que um byte não
>> >> >> são
>> >> >> oito
>> >> >> bits. Byte é a quantidade de bits que um processador "morde" de
>> >> >> cada
>> >> >> vez.
>> >> >> Assim para um processador de 16 bits um byte são 16 bits. O termo
>> >> >> correcto
>> >> >> é octeto (como os franceses muito bem dizem).
>> >> >> No entanto as velocidades não são expressas em multiplos de 1000.
>> >> >> Isto tem a ver com a tecnologia utilizada na transmissão de dados.
>> >> >> Por exemplo em PDH cada canal de transmissão tem 64 kbps, isto
>> >> >> porque
>> >> >> é a
>> >> >> largura de banda necessária para, sem compressão, para um canal de
>> >> >> voz.
>> >> >> Estes 64 kpbs são obtidos com uma frequência de amostragem de 8 kHZ
>> >> >> e
>> >> >> codificação de 8 bits.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Estes canais de 64 kbps são agrupados numa estrutura de 32 canais
>> >> >> (time
>> >> >> slots) o que perfaz 2048 kbps.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Isto leva a que 1Mbps sejam na realidade 1024 kbps...
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Esta estrutura de 2Mbps é conhecida como E1.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Existe outra estrutura de dados chamada SDH mas essa é outra coisa.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> A verdade é que os operadores não podem garantir débitos fora da
>> >> >> sua
>> >> >> rede.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> 73
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Paulo Calvo
>> >> >>
>> >> >> CT1IDW
>> >> >>
>> >> >> ----- Original Message -----
>> >> >> From: "Jose Miguel Fonte" <etjfonte ua.pt>
>> >> >> To: "Resumo Noticioso Electrónico ARLA" <cluster radio-amador.net>
>> >> >> Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 5:52 PM
>> >> >> Subject: RE: ARLA/CLUSTER: Passagem atribulada para a TV
>> >> >> DigitalTerrestrenosE.U.A.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> > Correcção: 1 MB/s = 1 Mega Byte por segundo = 1 0485 76 bytes
>> >> >> > Peço desculpa pelo erro.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > On Thu, 2009-05-07 at 14:25 +0000, antonio matias wrote:
>> >> >> >> Olá Colega Mourato.
>> >> >> >> Olhe que 10Megas de velocidades já é bem bom!
>> >> >> >> Os operadores gostam de falar em 100 Megas , é um numero mais
>> >> >> >> apelativo, mas não representa a velocidade de trafego
>> >> >> >> mas sim a largura de banda disponível.
>> >> >> >> Estes 100 megas são partilhados pela zona e não querem dizer
>> >> >> >> velocidade de Mbps "Mega bytes por segundo".
>> >> >> >> Quanto mais gente houver a descarregar, mais partilhados estão
>> >> >> >> os
>> >> >> >> 100Megas de largura de banda, o que reduz a velocidade de
>> >> >> >> download.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> julgo ser assim o sistema.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> 73's
>> >> >> >> Matias
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ______________________________________________________________________
>> >> >> >> Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 14:08:44 +0000
>> >> >> >> Subject: Re: ARLA/CLUSTER: Passagem atribulada para a TV Digital
>> >> >> >> TerrestrenosE.U.A.
>> >> >> >> From: radiofarol gmail.com
>> >> >> >> To: ct4dk mail.telepac.pt; cluster radio-amador.net
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Pois colega Paulo
>> >> >> >> Até aí tudo bem, mas acontece que em campolide, e segundo o mapa
>> >> >> >> na
>> >> >> >> própria webpage é uma zona abrangida pela ZON100 megas, a 100
>> >> >> >> megas, e
>> >> >> >> eu estou a pagar como tal. Não solicitei o serviço de 50 megas,
>> >> >> >> mas
>> >> >> >> sim o de 100, e como tal é isso que me está a ser cobrado.
>> >> >> >> Assim, e
>> >> >> >> como acabei de fazer um teste em www.speedtest.net a esta
>> >> >> >> hora,
>> >> >> >> 15:04 a zon100 megas está a 9,6 megas download e a 1,8 megas
>> >> >> >> upload...Continuo a dizer que tudo isto é um embuste...Um
>> >> >> >> logro...Vender gato por lebre, mesmo debaixo do nariz das
>> >> >> >> autoridades,
>> >> >> >> e devem existir milhares de clientes a pagar um serviço de 10
>> >> >> >> megas
>> >> >> >> ao
>> >> >> >> preço de um de 100%.
>> >> >> >> Se não têm capacidade de me fornecer a velocidade contratada,
>> >> >> >> pois
>> >> >> >> que
>> >> >> >> não vendam esse serviço. É um problema deles, pois não lhes devo
>> >> >> >> nem
>> >> >> >> nunca devi um unico cêntimo
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> 73 de CT4RK
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> 2009/5/7 Paulo Santos <ct4dk mail.telepac.pt>
>> >> >> >> Olá Carlos e restantes colegas,
>> >> >> >> Pode não ser bem assim nao te esquecas que o serviço
>> >> >> >> ZON100
>> >> >> >> Megas é composto por duas vertentes o serviço de fibra
>> >> >> >> óptica
>> >> >> >> esse sim é que vai até aos 100Mb e o serviço
>> >> >> >> Eurodocsis3.0
>> >> >> >> que
>> >> >> >> vai até aos 50Mb
>> >> >> >> o Eurodocsis3.0 é normalmente instalado em locais onde
>> >> >> >> ainda
>> >> >> >> não haja fibra óptica e é distribuído pelos cabos
>> >> >> >> coaxiais
>> >> >> >> da
>> >> >> >> rede cabo, pode ser essa modalidade que eles te tenham
>> >> >> >> instalado
>> >> >> >> muito embora o serviço seja chamado de ZON100 Megas tens
>> >> >> >> só
>> >> >> >> os
>> >> >> >> 50Mb (ás vezes) e todos os inconvenientes na Internet
>> >> >> >> por
>> >> >> >> cabo
>> >> >> >> que é dividir a largura de banda com todos os
>> >> >> >> utilizadores
>> >> >> >> do
>> >> >> >> mesmo cabo.
>> >> >> >> Imagina que todos os utilizadores do mesmo cabo
>> >> >> >> contratam o
>> >> >> >> serviço ZON100 Megas e lhes é colocado o Eurodocsis3.0 a
>> >> >> >> 50Mb
>> >> >> >> se todos se ligarem no mesmo instante lá se vai os 50Mb
>> >> >> >> de
>> >> >> >> navegação.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> VY 73's de Paulo Santos, CT4DK
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Carlos Mourato escreveu:
>> >> >> >> Só espero que não seja um embuste como é a
>> >> >> >> ZON100
>> >> >> >> megas...Disse bem e volto a dizer!!!...A ZON 100
>> >> >> >> Megas
>> >> >> >> é uma fraude...Um embuste!! tenho esse serviço
>> >> >> >> assinado no QTH de LX, e desde a montagem, só no
>> >> >> >> primeiro dia chegou a 60 megas. Todos os
>> >> >> >> restantes
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> média é entre 7 e 10 megas. Depois telefona-se
>> >> >> >> para
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> pseudoassistencia da ZON a reclamar, e passadas
>> >> >> >> umas
>> >> >> >> horas já funciona a mais de 50 megas.
>> >> >> >> Entretanto,
>> >> >> >> passados uns dois ou tres dias lá começam de
>> >> >> >> mansinho
>> >> >> >> a cortar na banda e ao fim de uma semana já está
>> >> >> >> em
>> >> >> >> 10
>> >> >> >> megas de novo!!!... Nova chamada e quando o
>> >> >> >> "técnico"
>> >> >> >> que nem um portátil tem para configurar, chaga a
>> >> >> >> nossa
>> >> >> >> casa já abriram a torneira e lá estão os tais
>> >> >> >> 50/60
>> >> >> >> megas. Um telefonema para a empresa a dizer que
>> >> >> >> está
>> >> >> >> tudo bem, e ainda não chegou ao fundo da rua e
>> >> >> >> ja a
>> >> >> >> velocidade está a descer...
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Fazem dos clientes parvos, e desgraçado de quem
>> >> >> >> não
>> >> >> >> medir regularmente a velocidade da net!! Espero
>> >> >> >> que
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> TV digital não seja uma especie de ZON100 megas,
>> >> >> >> pois
>> >> >> >> desconfio que quando começarem a oferecer canais
>> >> >> >> em
>> >> >> >> HD, que precisam de quase toda a largura de
>> >> >> >> banda
>> >> >> >> disponivel, vão começar a cortar de mansinho na
>> >> >> >> largura dos canais livres. Como a maioria das
>> >> >> >> pessoas
>> >> >> >> não entende patavina disso, nem sonham que estão
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> ser
>> >> >> >> roubadas. E mesmo quando estiverem a ver TV aos
>> >> >> >> quadradinhos, não vão achar nada de anormal!...O
>> >> >> >> que
>> >> >> >> está a dar são os canais pagos em HD...Os livres
>> >> >> >> são
>> >> >> >> para a escumalha!!
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> 73 de CT4RK
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> 73 de CT4RK
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> 2009/5/6 CT1FZC/CLUSTER
>> >> >> >> <ct1fzc.cluster gmail.com>
>> >> >> >> Com HD 180€, só SD 130€
>> >> >> >> Já há por aí umas lojinhas a vender umas
>> >> >> >> caixinhas dessas.
>> >> >> >> Cuidado que as caixas Espanholas só são
>> >> >> >> MPEG-2, não funciona por cá!!!
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ----- Original Message -----
>> >> >> >> From: Gomes
>> >> >> >> To: Resumo Noticioso Electrónico
>> >> >> >> ARLA
>> >> >> >> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009
>> >> >> >> 10:40
>> >> >> >> PM
>> >> >> >> Subject: Re: ARLA/CLUSTER:
>> >> >> >> Passagem
>> >> >> >> atribulada para a TV Digital
>> >> >> >> TerrestrenosE.U.A.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Pois,a ajuda começava por ai...
>> >> >> >> O "aparelhinho" em Espanha custa
>> >> >> >> cerca
>> >> >> >> de 30 euros, quanto vai custar o
>> >> >> >> nosso???
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> 73 Gomes CT1HIX
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ----- Original
>> >> >> >> Message -----
>> >> >> >> From: Carlos Mourato
>> >> >> >> To: Resumo Noticioso
>> >> >> >> Electrónico ARLA
>> >> >> >> Sent: Wednesday, May 06,
>> >> >> >> 2009
>> >> >> >> 10:29 PM
>> >> >> >> Subject: Re:
>> >> >> >> ARLA/CLUSTER:
>> >> >> >> Passagem atribulada para
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> TV
>> >> >> >> Digital Terrestre
>> >> >> >> nosE.U.A.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> É sim!!!...Somos
>> >> >> >> diferentes
>> >> >> >> em
>> >> >> >> tudo!!!...Até nos
>> >> >> >> salários!
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> 2009/5/6 Gomes
>> >> >> >> <ct1hix sapo.pt>
>> >> >> >> Boas
>> >> >> >> O nosso sistema
>> >> >> >> de
>> >> >> >> TDT
>> >> >> >> é diferente do
>> >> >> >> resto
>> >> >> >> da europa, não
>> >> >> >> é???
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> 73 Gomes CT1HIX
>> >> >> >> -----
>> >> >> >> Original
>> >> >> >> Message
>> >> >> >> -----
>> >> >> >> From:
>> >> >> >> Carlos
>> >> >> >> Mourato
>> >> >> >> To:
>> >> >> >> Resumo
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Noticioso
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Electrónico
>> >> >> >> ARLA
>> >> >> >> Sent:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Wednesday,
>> >> >> >> May
>> >> >> >> 06, 2009
>> >> >> >> 10:06
>> >> >> >> PM
>> >> >> >> Subject:
>> >> >> >> Re:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ARLA/CLUSTER:
>> >> >> >> Passagem
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> atribulada
>> >> >> >> para a
>> >> >> >> TV
>> >> >> >> Digital
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Terrestre
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> nosE.U.A.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Freitas
>> >> >> >> Espero
>> >> >> >> que
>> >> >> >> esteja
>> >> >> >> tudo
>> >> >> >> bem
>> >> >> >> contigo, e
>> >> >> >> que já
>> >> >> >> não
>> >> >> >> tenhas
>> >> >> >> muito
>> >> >> >> QRM de
>> >> >> >> UHF
>> >> >> >> no
>> >> >> >> QTH
>> >> >> >> Pois ...
>> >> >> >> Fazes
>> >> >> >> isso
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> voluntáriamente,
>> >> >> >> a gente que merece isso, e é um acto de louvar. No entanto ao
>> >> >> >> que
>> >> >> >> me
>> >> >> >> referia era ao facto de ser a ANACOM e a PT a fazerem o convite
>> >> >> >> aos
>> >> >> >> amadores, e não o espirito solidário que os mais pequeninos de
>> >> >> >> Portugal
>> >> >> >> normalmente mostram. Repara bem na frase:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> the FCC
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> requested,
>> >> >> >> through
>> >> >> >> the
>> >> >> >> ARRL,
>> >> >> >> that
>> >> >> >> ham
>> >> >> >> radio
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> operators
>> >> >> >> assist
>> >> >> >> their
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> communities
>> >> >> >> in
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> preparing
>> >> >> >> for
>> >> >> >> the
>> >> >> >> digital
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> television
>> >> >> >> rollout
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Traduzindo
>> >> >> >> isto
>> >> >> >> para
>> >> >> >> Portugal
>> >> >> >> (não
>> >> >> >> para
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> português)
>> >> >> >> seria
>> >> >> >> assim:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> "O
>> >> >> >> pedido
>> >> >> >> da
>> >> >> >> ANACOM,
>> >> >> >> através
>> >> >> >> das
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> associações
>> >> >> >> de
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> radioamadores,
>> >> >> >> para que
>> >> >> >> os
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> radioamadores
>> >> >> >> prestem
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> assistencia
>> >> >> >> à
>> >> >> >> sua
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> comunidade,
>> >> >> >> de
>> >> >> >> modo a
>> >> >> >> preparar
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> mesma
>> >> >> >> para
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> transição
>> >> >> >> para
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> televisão
>> >> >> >> digital"
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Achas
>> >> >> >> que
>> >> >> >> seria
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> possivel???
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> 73 de
>> >> >> >> CT4RK
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> 2009/5/6
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> CT1FZC/CLUSTER
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> <ct1fzc.cluster gmail.com>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> E
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> porque
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> não,
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> os
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Radioamadores ajudarem os menos preparados na mudança. Eu já na
>> >> >> >> actual
>> >> >> >> situação analógica tenho feito por isso, em locais no interior
>> >> >> >> onde
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> população de mais idade não tem dinheiro para sistemas de
>> >> >> >> televisão
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> pagar, o único recurso é a via terrestre. É raro o fim de semana
>> >> >> >> quando
>> >> >> >> vou ao QTH adicional, que não seja solicitado para dá uma vista
>> >> >> >> de
>> >> >> >> olhos
>> >> >> >> a esta ou aquela televisão. Quando for a mudança para o digital
>> >> >> >> é
>> >> >> >> perfeitamente natural que os problema tenham uma dimensão
>> >> >> >> maior...
>> >> >> >> Temos
>> >> >> >> de ser positivos e aceitar as novas tecnologia. Se não, ainda
>> >> >> >> teríamos
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> ver por uma Tv"zinha" a Preto e Branco como aconteceu até aos
>> >> >> >> meus
>> >> >> >> 10
>> >> >> >> anos, altura que entrou a primeira TV a cores em casa!!! Ainda
>> >> >> >> me
>> >> >> >> recordo
>> >> >> >> como fosse hoje, um vizinho invejoso que disse à minha mãe: "Eu
>> >> >> >> gosto
>> >> >> >> mais de ver a preto e branco"... hehehe. Ainda dever ter uma TV
>> >> >> >> sem
>> >> >> >> cores
>> >> >> >> com certeza...
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ct1fzc
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >> -----
>> >> >> >> Original Message -----
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> From: João Gonçalves Costa
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> To: 'Resumo Noticioso Electrónico ARLA'
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 12:50 PM
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Subject: ARLA/CLUSTER: Passagem atribulada para a TV Digital
>> >> >> >> Terrestre
>> >> >> >> nosE.U.A.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Hams' help still needed in DTV switchover
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Not everyone is ready for the upcoming United States transition
>> >> >> >> to
>> >> >> >> all-digital television and ham radio's assistance is still
>> >> >> >> needed
>> >> >> >> in
>> >> >> >> the
>> >> >> >> public awareness campaign.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Jim Meachen, ZL2BHF, reports:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> According to the A.C. Neilsen Company, some 3.8 million, or 3.4%
>> >> >> >> of
>> >> >> >> all
>> >> >> >> United States households are still unprepared for the digital
>> >> >> >> television
>> >> >> >> transition slated to take place on June 12th.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Geographically, Albuquerque, New Mexico, is the least prepared,
>> >> >> >> with
>> >> >> >> 9.4%
>> >> >> >> having no over-the-air digital reception capability. It’s
>> >> >> >> followed
>> >> >> >> by
>> >> >> >> the
>> >> >> >> Dallas-Fort Worth metroplex and Houston, Texas, each with 6.3%
>> >> >> >> of
>> >> >> >> the
>> >> >> >> citizenry not ready for the transition.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> On the other side of the equation, the most digital ready cities
>> >> >> >> appear
>> >> >> >> to be New Haven and Hartford, Connecticut and the Providence to
>> >> >> >> New
>> >> >> >> Bedford region of Rhode Island. Each of these have less than one
>> >> >> >> percent
>> >> >> >> of their citizens unprepared for the digital TV change.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> As previously reported, several months ago the FCC requested,
>> >> >> >> through
>> >> >> >> the
>> >> >> >> ARRL, that ham radio operators assist their communities in
>> >> >> >> preparing
>> >> >> >> for
>> >> >> >> the digital television rollout. Many radio clubs across the U.S.
>> >> >> >> have
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> reportedly become involved as advisors in this ongoing public
>> >> >> >> service
>> >> >> >> effort, nationwide.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Jim Meachen, ZL2BHF
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Again, the date for the transition to digital television in the
>> >> >> >> United
>> >> >> >> States is June 12th. If your club wants to assist in helping the
>> >> >> >> public
>> >> >> >> to be prepared for the move, please contact the ARRL
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER mailing list
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER
>> >> >> >> mailing list
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> --
>> >> >> >> Best 73
>> >> >> >> from:
>> >> >> >> regards
>> >> >> >> from:
>> >> >> >> CT4RK
>> >> >> >> Carlos
>> >> >> >> Mourato
>> >> >> >> -
>> >> >> >> Sines -
>> >> >> >> Portugal
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Save the
>> >> >> >> Radio
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Spectrum!
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Eliminate
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Broadband
>> >> >> >> over
>> >> >> >> Power
>> >> >> >> Line.
>> >> >> >> Salve as
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> frequencias
>> >> >> >> de
>> >> >> >> radio.
>> >> >> >> Não
>> >> >> >> use
>> >> >> >> a rede
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> electrica
>> >> >> >> para
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> transmitir
>> >> >> >> dados. O
>> >> >> >> PLC
>> >> >> >> causa
>> >> >> >> fortes
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> interferencias
>> >> >> >> noutro
>> >> >> >> serviços
>> >> >> >> sem
>> >> >> >> voce se
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> aperceber.
>> >> >> >> Diga não
>> >> >> >> ao
>> >> >> >> PLC.
>> >> >> >> Proteja o
>> >> >> >> ambiente
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >> -----------------------------------------------------------
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ______________
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER
>> >> >> >> mailing
>> >> >> >> list
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ______________________
>> >> >> >> Estou utilizando
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> versão gratuita
>> >> >> >> de
>> >> >> >> SPAMfighter para
>> >> >> >> usuários
>> >> >> >> privados.
>> >> >> >> Foi removido 117
>> >> >> >> emails de spam
>> >> >> >> até
>> >> >> >> hoje.
>> >> >> >> Os usuários
>> >> >> >> pagantes
>> >> >> >> não têm esta
>> >> >> >> mensagem
>> >> >> >> nos seus emails.
>> >> >> >> Experimente
>> >> >> >> SPAMfighter de
>> >> >> >> graça
>> >> >> >> agora!
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER mailing
>> >> >> >> list
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> --
>> >> >> >> Best 73 from: regards
>> >> >> >> from:
>> >> >> >> CT4RK Carlos Mourato -
>> >> >> >> Sines -
>> >> >> >> Portugal
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Save the Radio Spectrum!
>> >> >> >> Eliminate Broadband over
>> >> >> >> Power
>> >> >> >> Line. Salve as
>> >> >> >> frequencias
>> >> >> >> de
>> >> >> >> radio. Não use a rede
>> >> >> >> electrica para
>> >> >> >> transmitir
>> >> >> >> dados. O PLC causa
>> >> >> >> fortes
>> >> >> >> interferencias noutro
>> >> >> >> serviços
>> >> >> >> sem voce se aperceber.
>> >> >> >> Diga
>> >> >> >> não ao PLC. Proteja o
>> >> >> >> ambiente
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >> -----------------------------------------------------------
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ______________________________
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER mailing list
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ______________________________________
>> >> >> >> Estou utilizando a versão
>> >> >> >> gratuita
>> >> >> >> de
>> >> >> >> SPAMfighter para usuários
>> >> >> >> privados.
>> >> >> >> Foi removido 117 emails de spam
>> >> >> >> até
>> >> >> >> hoje.
>> >> >> >> Os usuários pagantes não têm
>> >> >> >> esta
>> >> >> >> mensagem nos seus emails.
>> >> >> >> Experimente SPAMfighter de graça
>> >> >> >> agora!
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ______________________________________
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER mailing list
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER mailing list
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> --
>> >> >> >> Best 73 from: regards from: CT4RK Carlos
>> >> >> >> Mourato -
>> >> >> >> Sines - Portugal
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Save the Radio Spectrum! Eliminate Broadband
>> >> >> >> over
>> >> >> >> Power Line. Salve as frequencias de radio. Não
>> >> >> >> use
>> >> >> >> a
>> >> >> >> rede electrica para transmitir dados. O PLC
>> >> >> >> causa
>> >> >> >> fortes interferencias noutro serviços sem voce
>> >> >> >> se
>> >> >> >> aperceber. Diga não ao PLC. Proteja o ambiente
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >> -----------------------------------------------------------
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ______________________________________________________
>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER mailing list
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ______________________________________________________
>> >> >> >> Não foram detectados vírus nesta entrada
>> >> >> >> mensagem.
>> >> >> >> Verificado por AVG - www.avg.com
>> >> >> >> Versão: 8.5.323 / Base de dados de Vírus:
>> >> >> >> 270.12.21/2101 - Data de Lançamento: 05/06/09 17:58:00
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER mailing list
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> --
>> >> >> >> Best 73 from: regards from: CT4RK Carlos Mourato - Sines -
>> >> >> >> Portugal
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Save the Radio Spectrum! Eliminate Broadband over Power Line.
>> >> >> >> Salve
>> >> >> >> as
>> >> >> >> frequencias de radio. Não use a rede electrica para transmitir
>> >> >> >> dados.
>> >> >> >> O PLC causa fortes interferencias noutro serviços sem voce se
>> >> >> >> aperceber. Diga não ao PLC. Proteja o ambiente
>> >> >> >> -----------------------------------------------------------
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> ______________________________________________________________________
>> >> >> >> Conheça os novos produtos Windows Live. Clique aqui!
>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER mailing list
>> >> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> CLUSTER mailing list
>> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> CLUSTER mailing list
>> >> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> CLUSTER mailing list
>> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> CLUSTER mailing list
>> >> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> >> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> CLUSTER mailing list
>> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> CLUSTER mailing list
>> CLUSTER radio-amador.net
>> http://radio-amador.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cluster
>
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
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